Possible proposals for Dunsink

This from Terry Moseley

David

Hi folks,

You'll probably have seen my other email about the decision to close Dunsink
Observatory (subject to final confirmation - but I'm fairly sure it's
correct).

So what do we do - if anything?

One possible option is to campaign for 'responsibility' or 'custody' of the
12" South refractor & dome to be handed over to IFAS, or to an umbrella group
comprising all amateur astronomer bodies in Ireland. The latter would have to
include A.I. In fact, I can't see the former being approved, as it would
exclude A.I., which like it or not is the largest amateur (OK, let's not argue about
definitions here) astronomy organsiation in Ireland. How would others feel
about that?

With equal voting rights for each member Club/Society, such a group could not
be dominated by any one Club, no matter how big. But it would mean all of us
working together to a common objective, regardless of past problems or
personality differences. Is that possible?

Other questions:

1. Would 'we' want to take on that responsibility?
2. Could we do it in practice, i.e. could we devote the necessary, and
continuing, time & resources & people to use it & manage it & maintain it?
3. What would we actually do with it? Use for observation by members of our
clubs? For public open nights? For a mixture of both?
4. What use would it be to the more distant member clubs? If it ends up being
used by, or just maintained by, the Greater Dublin based clubs only, will the
other clubs continue to want to be involved?
5. What about insurance - for us, and for the telescope & dome?
6. Could it become a 'poisoned chalice' , or a 'white elephant', for us,?

Could someone please post this to the IFAS forum, as I can't do it!

Thanks,

Terry Moseley

This seems like a good idea, and if thought of properly, is not too impractical. There would be a lot of responsibility on the clubs, but decisions would have to come down to a committee of representative persons, would it not?

IF such a group (IFAS, or other) were to 'aquire' those facilities, would it qualify for grants e.g. National Lottery, amenity and resource, perhaps even entrepreneurial? (is that how I spell it?)

Just because it lies in Dublin, does not mean that the Greater Dublin clubs are going to benefit most. Sure, they are the closest, but like it was mentioned above, no one particular club has durisdiction over it.

It sounds like a good plan to salvage what is left, and keep the name Dunsink alive as a working observatory.

What about thoughts as to what DIAS would think about it being alleviated from their hands so to speak in this manner?

Seanie.

I'd really liek ot see the amateur community take over Dunsink.

The optimist in me says that this is a great opportunity to pull together the massively split Irish amateur scene and work together for a change. Dunsink could be the start of the end of the massive rift that has dogged Irish Astronomy for years now.

The pesimist in me says it will never work and it will only widden the rift further.

I'm not at all sure which part of me is right

I'm not at all sure which part of me is right

Probaly both Bart. Look at the huge rift that exists, and the 2 priciples of thinking that started it all.

If those pricniples could be left out, then the rift should not even matter.

Seanie

Okay, time to wade in here and tread on a few toes!

This is a ridiculous idea, and I think it is beyond the remit of IFAS to get involved with this. "Let by-gones be by-gones" is all well and good for those who remember the split or who were interested in astronomy at the time of the split, but there are those of us involved in the hobby who don't recall the split and who weren't involved at the time when various personalities soured things for the next generation. We have problems with Astronomy Ireland Ltd that go beyond the bad taste left in people's mouths by the split. I personally have great issues with the organisation and running of Astronomy Ireland, as well as it's presentation as the national astronomy club/society, that have nothing to do with splits, splitters, or splitted. I don't like the way they do business. I don't like the insularity of the organisation and the "fumble in a greasy till" attitude to profit. I do like IFAS. I like the idea of an Irish representative body that looks after the hobby and the enthusiasts. I like the fact that I can come on here and bitch, moan, gripe and pontificate and start a row; I can express an opinion, something which AI members (all 8,000 of them - almost twice the membership of the Royal Astronomical Society of Canada) can't do in their organisation.

Haven't people heard of the idea of competition? I thought that IFAS and AI were in competition for the "hearts and minds" of the Irish astronomer. Here is, perhaps, an opportunity for IFAS to step up to the mark and get itself better known. What do we propose to do? Well, let's ask nicely and see what happens. NICE GUYS FINISH LAST! THERE IS NO "I" IN TEAM! VARIOUS OTHER ASSORTED PEP-TALK SLOGANS! Do you honestly think that anyone in AI is pondering joining up with us and asking nicely?

If, big IF, DIAS said sure - let's set up a committee with people from each of these organisations to look after the refractor - then why should a group with 8,000 members (again, that's almost TWICE the membership of the RASC, a group which can print books!) have the same say as a group from a small town in Ireland? Bring yer membership books to the table, I say! Let's count them members, make the numbers public, and then establish a proportional system that gives seats on this committee depending on membership. That's if people want to go with this idea.

In my own humble opinion, quietly expressed, I think that co-operating with AI on this issue is a bad idea. I think co-operation with them is a bad idea. AI are bad for the hobby. IFAS is good for the hobby. We should stand on our own and be counted.
Sure, the refractor is a national treasure and one that should remain on the island and be used to open people's eyes to the miracles of the universe. In it's present incarnation IFAS is not equipped to take on this role. A newwer [sic] IFAS, which uses some of the nuts left over from last night, could and should look after this treasure before it ends up in a museum in the States.

(::RANT MODE DISABLED:

Anyone else agree?

Its all fine saying what should be done, but who is going to do it??
Somebody from the IFAS committe or someone selected needs to take ownership of this NOW, someone with the know how, and approach DIAS or whoever is in charge.
If its left too late, you know who could be incharge.