IFAS, roads, national astronomy... was Sligo Astronomy Group

dmcdona wrote:

johnomahony wrote: with basic kitchen and toilet facilities to interact with each other

I would be happy to share my experiences with anyone who is interested.

John - please *do* share...

I think I have a few photos.... :laugh:

I did mention it was a scout camp

manic_dave wrote: I believe that astronomy needs a strong voice in Ireland at the armature level otherwise its left to David Moore.

And I don't see there being any objection to it. However, the crux of the problem is that Moore - and here we go in circles again (like an annual trip round the Sun) - has got the (a) time, (b) resources because he has the time, (c) lots of contacts to badger because he has the time to sift the net and other media sources for those resources, and (d) a desire to make money from it.

Your suggestion has not fallen on deaf ears in the 15 years IFAS has been around, it just has to be tackled as best as is possible. Your contacts in Republic of Astronomy will say the same thing. Your fellow amateur club members in the clubs across the island will say the same thing.

You and I have only known each other a couple of years Dave, and we both know how we each want to see Moore toppled from his perch for a very long time. But if he is able to basically make a living out of it because it is all he has, then by your own reckoning, IFAS has lost the race a long time ago.

But, ergo, it never was a race to begin with.

Seanie.

Hello everyone - hope ye are all well in astroland! It's been a while since a posted anything of value but I've always been lurking away in the background... Anyhow, I'm a sucker for a [strike]argument[/strike] discussion about IFAS.

Firstly, whether this post is in fact anything of value is up to you.
Secondly, like all the others in this thread, this is my opinion.
Thirdly, I state these opinions because I actually have an interest and care somewhat for what I believe is a good organisation.
Lastly, these opinions of mine are mostly in response to Manic Dave's opinions. So, with that out the way...

IFAS - say the words to yourself - "Irish Federation of Astronomical Societies". Its an umbrella organisation - it controls no-one. It has supported and funded many events over the years in support of all affiliates but more importantly, those events were open to everyone - not just the affiliates. IFAS is run by volunteers - no-one receives a penny for the hours, days and weeks of work put in - you know who you are. This website is "donated" and managed for free. People have put their hands in their own pockets and spent cold hard cash on IFAS matters. All of these people deserve nothing but credit.

IFAS is democratic - you want to change it? Go ahead. But because its democratic, everyone gets a say and the majority rules. If you don't get what you want you've two options:

1. Take a deep breath, calm your beans and row in with what the majority wants
2. Go away

Personally, I was involved with IFAS projects that didn't work out. I was disappointed but I didn't get the hump and start throwing my rattle out of the pram. I realised that because IFAS is supportive of all kinds of astronomy, it has to spread itself thinly to cover everything. IFAS didn't/doesn't exist to pander to my own personal wants or needs. That is a very selfish perspective. I was involved in many more IFAS project that worked exceptionally well to the credit of all involved. Project that had little interest for me - but it wasn't about me.

All this talk of Star Parties - what about the people who can't go travelling to the far corners of this Island (or even Turkey!)? Work/family commitments, disability, lack of cold hard cash (not a cheap hobby). What about those that simply do not want to go? Perhaps not antisocial but more than happy in their own company. If IFAS spent all its resources flogging star parties, you alienate a lot of people who enjoy other aspects of this hobby. That is definitely what IFAS is not in the game for. It has to cater for as many aspects of the hobby as possible and for all levels of participation - sat in front of a PC screen all the way to a full blown three days without a shower, bitten half to death and eating suspicious food.

As for Astronomy Ireland and David Moore - really, get over it. Life is too short to have an unhealthy obsession in spending time attacking that person/organisation over and over and over and over... You are wasting your time. Think about it - in all time that he/it has been discussed on these boards, at Star Parties etc. what difference did it make? Zip. Move on.

Rather than go through each of your points in more detail Manic Dave, I have to be honest - my opinion is that you're talking a lot of rubbish and you have been disrespectful to individuals. I suspect that many people here read your post and rolled their eyes to heaven. But of course, that is my opinion. You certainly need to brush up on your "how to win friends and influence people" tactics if you want to make any of the changes you think are needed.

My advice to you is build a bridge, get over it, row in behind IFAS and with a bit more respect, and put your suggestions forward in a constructive manner. Until you do that, you will be nothing more than a really annoying squeaky worn bearing.

Done.
Dave

@Dave Mcd, that attack on Manic Dave was truly uncalled for, he after all was voicing his concern and opinion for a subject he feels passionate about.. He didn't attack any individual but only voiced his concern about a society he believes could be run better.. In my opinion, an apology is called for here.

Done Roy

dmcdona wrote:
My advice to you is build a bridge, get over it, row in behind IFAS and with a bit more respect, and put your suggestions forward in a constructive manner. Until you do that, you will be nothing more than a really annoying squeaky worn bearing.

Done.
Dave

As a former chairperson of IFAS I would have though you would have more about you than insults. If this is your contribution to the discussion about IFAS, attacking me, that is pretty sad mate.

Seanie constructive points thank you. I would say that maybe a larger IFAS with a bigger ground base, ie take into account Republic of Astronomy ect, would give you the mandate to stand as the voice of Armature Irish Astronomy.
But you have to take my point that the current IFAS model does not fit everyone, us in SSP for example. It galls me, as it does you to see Moore charge people 35 euro for a burger and a talk when for example cosmos will give you 3 days of astronomy for that. I think he needs to be met head on. Social media is the way to do that, we can learn a lot from what ROA have done.

Dave L yeah, perhaps I take the point, I think what im saying is IFAS needs to change because the times have changed. And I think everyone should have a vote in who gets the top job. For example, you want to be chair, you need a nomination from a club and then the nominated get voted on by the members. That way people with ideas for example can look to get elected and make things happen.

thanks for the reply Dave,
but can you explain something to me, I was under the impression that this ROA was a facebook page run buy a guy who put up stuff there to promote events or anything else that comes up in the space and astronomy world, you're talking like this is a group/movement or a club somewhere?, so whats the story behind it ?