UN Human Rights Charter invoked in Croke Park objection

Guys,
Relax, if you want to fight it out over the GAA, go to boards.ie or through private mails.

If you think you have it bad, have a look at what they're building literally 150 meters from me!! the new Thomand Park.
www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2055019884
Scroll down through the link and have a good look at all the pics :shock:

Now, I actually dont mind as I like Munster rugby and since it costs a fortune to run these lights, they are on ONLY when there is a match on and thats not often to be honest, so I just get over it and go on with life.

I actually get people during match time calling to my house offering money for a parking space in my driveway :lol:

Well done Bart for having the honesty to identify yourself as an unadulterated anti-GAA bigot. Identifying homophobia as a peculiarly GAA phenomenon is really low; you should be ashamed of yourself. It's a distasteful prejudice common to all sporting and non-sporting bodies, and indeed all walks of life. Why don't you go the whole hog and blame the cocaine epidemic on the GAA too? Frankly, you've lost the plot, and your prejudices stand revealed to all.

I'm sorry but I don't see your point at all. You admit there is a problem, but because others share the problem, you claim it is not a problem and is somehow not to be condemed. In fact you go further and condem me for pointing out a very real issue that you admit exists. You are a member of the GAA, and you are defending their homophobia, so you rather prove my point really.

Secondly, from my direct experience with sporting organisations it is NOT a problem common to all sporting organisations. Pretending that it is a cop-out.

Is this an Astronomy thread or a GAA bashing thread? My starting point is that this is a Dark Skies thread and that every major stadium in the world has flood lighting. Do you think the residents near Old Trafford, or Giants Stadium, or Stade de France love the flood-lighting there, where there are a hell of a lot more night games played than will ever be played at Croker; of course not, but they don't incessantly whinge about it. Guess what, living next to a major stadium involves disruption. Get used to it. The sporting public want night games. Move on.

The only argument I see there is that because others do it it's not a problem. By your 'logic' we should cut back the Guardai because there are countries with much higher crime rates than us so we obviously don't need as many police.

Just because there are people in other cities who have to suffer does not make it OK for Dublin people to have to suffer. If there are real arguments in favor of blasting out needless light and reducing the quality of life of people and wasting vast swathes of energy please present them but "others do it too" is not a valid reason to do anything.

I really enjoyed the flood-lit rugby game between Leinster and Agen last weekend at Lansdowne. My sympathy goes to the locals who have to put up with this gross violation of their human rights, but at the same time I want to see more of these great spectacles.

Do you not find that a bit selfish? you are obviously aware that your pleasure is causing others pain but you seem not to care. Is it really that important that the match happen at night? Is the Sun not a fine enough source of illumination for playing Rugby?

As I see it there are two arguments against floodlighting sports arenas:

1) It's a waste of energy. We need to conserve energy and cut out waste and excess. I see floodlit sports events as an excess. It's not a NEED.
2) People have a right to a descent quality of life. Experiments have shown that excessive lighting at night is un-healthy. I don't think the 'spectacle' of a sporting event is a good enough reason to compromise people's quality of life.

Mind you I very obviously don't get sport, I look at it rather logically and don't pin my happiness on the performance of a particular team. Sure, I PLAY sport and enjoy it but I don't follow it.

Bart.

Albert

Sincerest apologies for mistaking you for Bart. :oops: This really is a gross violation of your human rights. I am deeply regretful for this error, and cannot begin to understand the pain and suffering caused.

James

eh?

Relax a bit there James. Really, no offence caused, I think I've already recovered from the pain and suffering and hopefully my human rights are still intact! :lol:

I actually get people during match time calling to my house offering money for a parking space in my driveway :lol:

I hope the, eh, 'car park security' lights are all pointing downwards

Folks

This is my last post on this thread, which has elements which are obviously way off topic. I am not prepared to let Bart highjack this thread to engage in a spurious bit of GAA bashing. There are so many GAA stereotypes (prejudices) in his arguments that it would make for a really good episode of The Simpsons. I mean the "Guardai" and "higher crime rates". Talk about an analogy too far. In my experience homophobia is endemic to all sporting dressing rooms; maybe it's the side of the tracks I come from. To label it as a peculiarly GAA phenomenon, I find outrageous, disgusting and willfully misleading. You've lost the plot, and if you want to embarrass yourself any further, go right ahead, I won't be responding.

There are at least thirty venues in Dublin City alone, that have flood-lighting on a minimum of four nights a week. These include GAA, Rugby, Soccer, Tennis, and Hockey clubs. They provide a valuable service to members during our long winter nights. The aggregate sky glow would dwarf that of Croke Park flood-lighting. Croker would probably require flood-lighting for maybe ten nights a year (3 soccer internationals, 3 rugby internationals, 4 football and hurling nights. It's a guess, so please don't beat me up). If you want to be consistent Bart, you should be campaigning against these other venues too.

The flood-lighting battle is lost. No need to keep re-fighting it. Let's move on to battles with a possibility of victory.

Dave, thanks for comments re. Thomand Park. I think it puts a bit of perspective on things. Good win against Cardiff on Sunday.

Albert, I was only jesting with that last comment. Just sick of the raimeis that I felt obliged to respond to.

Adieu and Clear Skies
James

Folks

This is my last post on this thread, which has elements which are obviously way off topic. I am not prepared to let Bart highjack this thread to engage in a spurious bit of GAA bashing. There are so many GAA stereotypes (prejudices) in his arguments that it would make for a really good episode of The Simpsons. I mean the "Guardai" and "higher crime rates". Talk about an analogy too far. In my experience homophobia is endemic to all sporting dressing rooms; maybe it's the side of the tracks I come from. To label it as a peculiarly GAA phenomenon, I find outrageous, disgusting and willfully misleading. You've lost the plot, and if you want to embarrass yourself any further, go right ahead, I won't be responding.

There are at least thirty venues in Dublin City alone, that have flood-lighting on a minimum of four nights a week. These include GAA, Rugby, Soccer, Tennis, and Hockey clubs. They provide a valuable service to members during our long winter nights. The aggregate sky glow would dwarf that of Croke Park flood-lighting. Croker would probably require flood-lighting for maybe ten nights a year (3 soccer internationals, 3 rugby internationals, 4 football and hurling nights. It's a guess, so please don't beat me up). If you want to be consistent Bart, you should be campaigning against these other venues too.

The flood-lighting battle is lost. No need to keep re-fighting it. Let's move on to battles with a possibility of victory.

Dave, thanks for comments re. Thomand Park. I think it puts a bit of perspective on things. Good win against Cardiff on Sunday.

Albert, I was only jesting with that last comment. Just sick of the raimeis that I felt obliged to respond to.

Adieu and Clear Skies
James

You obviously didn't actually read my post because it's clear you're not actually replying to points I made. I never said that homophobia is only a problem in the GAA. It is however a real problem in the GAA and your response proves my point perfectly. You simply don't see it as being worth dealing with and because I point out this rather inconvenient truth you hurl abuse at me. Nice one. That will really fix things.

Also, I did very clearly state that I was against all floodlighting for sporting events so my position is perfectly consistent. Just because my opinion is not a popular one does not make it any less valid. I have given two arguments against them, you have not given anything more coherent in reply than "others do it so we should too", which even a 5 year old soon realises is not actually a valid argument.

Do you have any actual arguments in favour of floodlighting?

Bart.