How to photograph the Moonrise behind a predetermined object

Firstly this is not me saying:
'This is how you do it'

I've been chatting to Anthony 'A' lately about these
shots and he has been kind enough to direct me to some posts he
made on other astronomy boards on the problem and more specifically
How he deals with it.

Hopefully this will be more of an open
discussion on how best to achieve a shot the likes of one of these
amazing images:
(hope you don't mind me posting this here Anto!)
The LPOD - April 19th 2009 - Anthony Ayiomamitis
lpod.wikispaces.com/file/view/LPOD-Apr19...09/LPOD-Apr19-09.jpg


And this one from another:
i282.photobucket.com/albums/kk246/sdcm83...e_baldridge_c800.jpg



So, there are a few separate areas that you need some knowledge in before
even attempting this.
You'll need to know your scope and camera set up.
Important so you will have enough FOV to get the Moon & object in the shot.
Your mount and how to adjust the scope is also a concern.

Then there is the selection of the object (building, landmark - whatever)
and how far away you will need to be for the shot.

Critically important is knowing at what exact point on the horizon
and time that the Moon will rise.
The elevation of both you and your object is a factor here also.

You will also want the lighting to be right so that you get
a nice balance between the moon and the foreground object.

So lots to work out here....

My way of doing this would be.
Once I had an object picked,
I'd do a recon trip in daylight and Take a few test shots and get the distance right.
Then get gps points & alt. on the sat nav.


Use Starry Night with the exact Coordinates for the
spot you are going to shoot from to work out Moon Rise
times and dates.

Then use Google earth to visualize alt. / directions et..
and use an OS map to get accurate alt of the object at horizon.

Then a day or two before the evening of actual Moonrise,
head to the shooting spot and accuratly time and note where on the horizon is the
start of Moonrise and mark a time for when it will reach desired alt.
(to be nicely behind your object on the Day)

Then put all this in place and hope for clear weather!

Now,
this is me very much thinking out loud...
I'm hoping there is an easier way!!
Please enlighten me!
:laugh:








1 -

Hi Frank,

I am going by shear memory but I seem to recall a thread where I described the procedure and how to determine the necessary factors that go into preparing and identifying such an opportunity.

There is nothing wrong with reiterating the analysis and which is the following:

(1) the moon has an approximate apparent diameter of 30 arc-minutes. To this end, we need a proper distance with a clear view of our proposed foreground which yield an apparent diameter also around 30 arc-minutes. This depends on knowing or estimating the actual diameter of our foreground from the proposed angle involving the final shot. Once we have this physical diameter, we can use basic trigonometry to derive the distance needed for this physical diameter to have an apparent diameter around 30 arc-minutes.

(2) it is critical that the moon be captured while it is two degrees in altitude (or less) since this is where we are in a position to have a natural balance in lighting and brightness between the rising full moon and the immediate environment

(3) further to (2) above, we also need the sun to be between four and six degrees below the horizon while the full moon is rising so as to be able to have the natural balance I describe above for a single exposure to be possible. If you need a very rough rule of thumb, we are talking about 20-25 minutes after the sun has set but this varies slightly since the angle of the ecliptic during the year is variable. Always keep in mind the rule about the sun being below the horizon by four to six degrees and you will always be fine

(4) the final step is the azimuth since we want the rising full moon behind our desired foreground. This can be derived in various ways including Google Earth (my preference) or some celestial body such as a planet (ex. Mars right now) or a bright star (ex. Sirius)

Once you have the necessary azimuth, altitude, time of moonrise, location of the sun below the horizon and the proper distance, the photos I produce are very doable and, dare I say, relatively easy.

My biggest problem with the above four steps was (3) and which required fifteen months to discover and after many failed attempts and long drives to Sounion.

You may remember the article in the Aug/2004 issue of S&T relating to the marathon from the time of Ancient Greece. Well, I had received an email from S&T asking me for various photos and including the full moon from Cape Sounion which were to be used for supplementing the material in the article. Although I could not get the perfect shot for the article, I finally managed to have all of the ingredients in the puzzle worked out fifteen months later with my first taste of success here: www.perseus.gr/Astro-Lunar-Scenes-Sounion-01.htm , www.perseus.gr/Astro-Lunar-Scenes-Sounion-02.htm and www.perseus.gr/Astro-Lunar-Scenes-Sounion-03.htm . These photos were purposely wideangle since this is what the magazine had requested. In 2008 I returned for a much closer field of view shot and which you recognize: www.perseus.gr/Astro-Lunar-Scenes-Sounion-04.htm , www.perseus.gr/Astro-Lunar-Scenes-Sounion-05.htm and www.perseus.gr/Astro-Lunar-Scenes-Sounion-06.htm .

I forgot to mention that the balance in natural lighting lasts only a few minutes (3-4 minutes) and it is vital that you do all of your work during this very brief window of opportunity. Also, remember to bracket your exposures by 2/3 stops using exposure compensation. Finally, as a starting point, start out with something around ISO 100 and 0.4 (or 0.5) seconds and let the histogram at the back of the LCD be your guide as to how you may need to slightly adjust your exposure.

Whatever other info you need, just let me know!

Anthony.

PS. By the way, the LPOD photo in your first link was taken by my good friend Chris Kotsiopoulos. I arrived eight minutes late due to heavy traffic and, thankfully, Chris was there earlier and managed to get the shot. It was taken from a distance of slightly over four kilometers! Just a little patience and this year I will correct for last year's late arrival.

Thanks for your generous advice as always Anthony!
These kind of shots are not easy but are great fun planning.

With the little spare time I get of late to take photos
I've been doing some work on getting these kind of shots right.
Many thanks to Anthony for his kind help and advice.
I have to say...
it's difficult to get the shot right.
First off...our weather here is NOT helping.
How many times a year is it clear down to the horizon here!!?
A handful... plus there are only a few days when the Sun / Moon
will be in the right position for you so...it makes it even harder.
Planning and recon are the only thing you can do...

So anyway.
here are a couple of shots I took sort of as practice..



The setting Moon over Bunratty Castle.
I was actually a KM further back and I could see that the clouds were going to beat me so I drove twoards it to gain a bit of angle, not the shot I had in mind but close.
The Sun was rising to my back and thats the reflection of it in
the castle windows.




Moon setting in the morning by St. Johns Cathedral in Limerick.
Again, beaten by clouds.