The new website - A failure or success.

Phoenix,
I would agree to a large extent to what you are saying, you may remember my previous posts on this very issue arguing for the very same thing, that images generated by our contributors need to be given more lattitue and not tied down to strict guidelines. The facts are coming home to roost as I knew they would.

The IFAS site is slowly dying and I don't think anyone who uses these boards can deny it. But don't think its a single issue to identify and resolve, its not. These things are a little more complex than that, its usually down to a combination of issues. Lack of e-mail notification is just a single element. The issuance of strict conditions for posting images is another. But what I believe is the single biggest problem manifested itself some time ago and culminated in a prominant poster being bullied and forced to go into "hibernation". I speak of course of PJ, and though I frequently disagreed and argued with him, I will stand up for his right to speak without being bullied.

The number of PMs I have received since I started this thread has been a revelation to me, I didn't realise how much trouble IFAS is in. Previous Admins of the site and people close to IFAS council have confided a lot and you can ignore a single gripe but not when everyone is saying the same thing. One theme that keeps on cropping up is bullying, ganging up on a single naysayer and shooting him down. Now, thats OK in business, I deal with it every day and expect and can deal with it, however in the environment of leisure and astronomy its a bit disquieting.

Michael - I know you are an honorable man and would not stand for what is happening, but do you know what is happening?

I am debating with myself wether to submit this post or not, but in the interests of the survival of IFAS and this site I feel I must hit the "SUBMIT" button. Roll on the consequences. I was hoping that it would all end with the email issue - Bugger, now I've got to deal with this!

I think there is a bit of confusion on a number of fronts here:

1. The front page was re-organised as some people complained that it was dis-organised . Something has to go at the top and bottom of the page.

2. If there is demand for the photo comp to come back, that's no problem. Leave it with me and it will be back shortly.

3. Images uploaded via Flicker do not impact upon our bandwidth. Where it could pose a problem is for users on dial-up as a large image embedded into the post could take ages to load. The limit is 800pixels x 800pixels and 150kb. This is for the display of images directly within the post. Placing a link to an image which is much bigger than this is no problem and has no impact on the bandwidth of the website. If people want to discuss this rule, then let's discuss it in conjunction with feedback from users on dial-up.

4. John, that's some very heavy stuff you are throwing at us there re PJ. And no, I would not consider that behaviour appropriate in business either, but each to their own I guess. If you have some evidence to indicate that his treatment by us was unfair, show it to me. IIRC, PJ left because he did not want to take part in an astronomy website because it only discussed astronomy. So, rather than just discuss astronomy, he left. We are not here to compete with the likes of boards.ie etc. Sometimes a few posts can go a little off-topic and we try to allow a little bit of latitude. However, starting threads about the Lisbon Treaty etc, well, it's difficult to see the astronomy context there.

5. If anyone has a suggestion, let us know. If we think it's a good idea, we will try to implement it. That is why we have a Bugs, Suggestions and Feedback section. Alternatively, if one would prefer to keep it private, you can send a pm to anyone in the IFAS Council or web team.

6. The website, and IFAS in general, has always been run by a small number of volunteers who dedicate their spare time to helping others discuss astronomy through this website. None of us get paid for this job. Apologies if this is inadequate service. If someone is willing to volunteer to help out with the website in some way (photo comp, moderation etc), then let us know if you are interested and we can discuss.

7. IFAS is not in "trouble" with anyone. Care to clarify what you are talking about???

Michael.

Phoenix and JohnMurphy - Bang, Bang, Bang! That's the sound of nails being hit squarely on the head!

This used to be a great place but people, and not just PJ, have been driven out. I've seen it happen and indeed I've experienced it myself when the Chairman sent me a very rude PM which I invited him to apologise for which he declined to do. My door is still open.

Now as it happens I run a moderately successful forum myself and the way I deal with the off-topic chat which seems to be such a problem here is that we have a "General" part of the board in which anything goes. The way this works is that if someone posts something of interest to other posters then a discussion will ensue, and if the off-topis is of no interest then no-one else will join in - simple! No antagonism necessary, no offence caused.

Likewise, we've never had anyone rubbish the images of others as I have seen here - it tends to drive people away to the extent that although this forum has over 1400 users and mine has 54, my forum has more traffic despite the fact that we have much the same weather as you guys so stop making excuses!

There are problems here over and above the board software and they won't be resolved by adopting a head in the sand approach.

paulevans wrote:

I've seen it happen and indeed I've experienced it myself when the Chairman sent me a very rude PM which I invited him to apologise for which he declined to do. My door is still open.

As you are aware Paul, you used this site as a platform for throwing accusations at the EAAS and persons therein as you felt aggrieved at the actions taken against you by same. As discussed at length with you repeatedly, this is not acceptable. The matter between you and the EAAS is a private matter. The reasons why you are banned from the club is not a matter for IFAS to get involved with. Neither are we going to get involved in any potential legal issues, especially as they are outside of this state. The first few times you did this, we discussed the issue at length and we all thought the issue was perfectly clear & understood by everyone. However, for some reason you continued your course of action. Your conduct was discussed at length by the moderators and it is on the back of those discussions that you were issued with a PM warning you of your actions. We have never prevented you from talking astronomy on this site or involked any ban on you. You are more than welcome to discuss astronomy here, as stated to you by us repeatedly. But the issue between you and the EAAS, especially as it has legal complications, is not a matter for IFAS to get involved in.

I trust this clarifies the matter.

Michael.

Michael,

Your PM to me was way out of proportion to any offence I may have caused to others.

You owe me an apology. That you still refuse to deliver it says much more about you than it does about me.

I think you should consider resigning as IFAS Chair given the mess things appear to be in.

Being the Chairman of an organisation does not confer on you the right to bully members.

Can I just jump in and remind people that the site is not IFAS.
This is a bulletin board that's run by IFAS,
IFAS is alot more then just some bulletin board. From what I can see IFAS itself is ok.

I feel I can speak about the following as I was a mod at the time.
As for PJ, he left on his own accord because he wanted to talk about more then astronomy, in which case boards.ie would suit his needs alot more, he was not told to leave the site.
As for peoples images been rubbished, I don't remember any astronomical images that were?
If people started putting up images of sunflowers or stuff like that then obviously a few eyebrows will be raised.
Comments like "Adjust the levels, brightness" are the entire point of putting an image up, I'd want feedback on how to improve the image.
Paul, you argued over EAAS at nearly every opportunity, if you have a problem with EAAS then take it up with them, going on about it here will not resolve your issues.

From what I can see, the real problem here is that feedback is not been listened to, then people get annoyed, brushing feedback off with "what would you wan the functionality for" is a big no no especially when it keeps popping up.

Michael, you have tried to be as helpful as you can and would dive in there and sort the site issues out in an instant, but ultimately your hands are somewhat tied as you are not on the webteam.